Saturday, June 13, 2009
ΠΑΡΑΔΟΣΙΣ
I wrote:
Isn't the Aramaic for "betray" MSR? Isn't it unlikely that the gospel had this? If it was a version of ShLM wouldn't it mean "to perfect"?
One last question - any connection between MSR and BSR (a variant of BShR)?
Boid responds:
You have found the answer, I think. Let’s start with the Greek. The verb paradidónai (inf.) paradídômi (first person singular, the heading used in many dictionaries), abstract noun parádosis, in itself only means either “hand over” or hand on”, and is most commonly used in speaking of the handing on of a tradition. The noun parádosis means kabbalah in its most general meaning. (See Jastrow). It can mean to transfer someone from the custody of one legal authority to another. In the right context, it can mean to hand someone over to be arrested. Even in this case, it DOES NOT MEAN BETRAY in the sense of the word in current English. The word “betray” was used by the King James Version because at that time, four centuies ago, it had the definite meaning of handing over to be arrested by making information available to the government or legal authorities or by making the person accessible, sometimes by seizing the person. In this case there is no question of the betrayer seizing Jesus. The word can only mean “make accessible to the authorities to be arrested”. The Greek word even in this case has no connotation of what in current English is called treachery. That can only come from the context, not the word. There is therefore no need to find any hint of treachery, unless you first want to find it there. The Hebrew verb MSR has exactly the same range of meaning. Have a look at its repeated use at the start of the treatise Avot in the Mishnah.
Now it can be seen why the disciples ask “Is it me?”. Jesus says (a) “One of you is to make me accessible to be arrested” and (b) “One of you is to hand on my essence”. Judah was the only one strong enough.
No, you can’t connect MSR and Besorah. The root of Besorah is BET-SIN-RESH. The word Besorah, and from this the Greek Euangelion, comes from the numerous instances of the verb (always in the pi’el) and the derived pi’el participle mevasser מבשר I’m till trying to find the passage in the Torah that lies behind this usage in Isaiah and then the innovation of the use of the noun Besorah for the new literary form. Although it is true that the noun basar “flesh” comes from the same root, there is no connection.
Isn't the Aramaic for "betray" MSR? Isn't it unlikely that the gospel had this? If it was a version of ShLM wouldn't it mean "to perfect"?
One last question - any connection between MSR and BSR (a variant of BShR)?
Boid responds:
You have found the answer, I think. Let’s start with the Greek. The verb paradidónai (inf.) paradídômi (first person singular, the heading used in many dictionaries), abstract noun parádosis, in itself only means either “hand over” or hand on”, and is most commonly used in speaking of the handing on of a tradition. The noun parádosis means kabbalah in its most general meaning. (See Jastrow). It can mean to transfer someone from the custody of one legal authority to another. In the right context, it can mean to hand someone over to be arrested. Even in this case, it DOES NOT MEAN BETRAY in the sense of the word in current English. The word “betray” was used by the King James Version because at that time, four centuies ago, it had the definite meaning of handing over to be arrested by making information available to the government or legal authorities or by making the person accessible, sometimes by seizing the person. In this case there is no question of the betrayer seizing Jesus. The word can only mean “make accessible to the authorities to be arrested”. The Greek word even in this case has no connotation of what in current English is called treachery. That can only come from the context, not the word. There is therefore no need to find any hint of treachery, unless you first want to find it there. The Hebrew verb MSR has exactly the same range of meaning. Have a look at its repeated use at the start of the treatise Avot in the Mishnah.
Now it can be seen why the disciples ask “Is it me?”. Jesus says (a) “One of you is to make me accessible to be arrested” and (b) “One of you is to hand on my essence”. Judah was the only one strong enough.
No, you can’t connect MSR and Besorah. The root of Besorah is BET-SIN-RESH. The word Besorah, and from this the Greek Euangelion, comes from the numerous instances of the verb (always in the pi’el) and the derived pi’el participle mevasser מבשר I’m till trying to find the passage in the Torah that lies behind this usage in Isaiah and then the innovation of the use of the noun Besorah for the new literary form. Although it is true that the noun basar “flesh” comes from the same root, there is no connection.
Email stephan.h.huller@gmail.com with comments or questions.